Downton Abbey ~ Much to Discuss!

Well, it was another fantastic episode - and once again there's a whole lot to talk about! (And *wow* what a cliffhanger!) As usual, I'm still working out my own thoughts, but as soon as I am able, I will post them in the comments box below.

Can't wait to "chat" with you all!

:)

Comments

[Karen Edmisten]

I'm late to the party but it's never really too late to dish Downton. :)

I don't think Bates killed Vera but I think he'll be arrested for it. Lord Grantham may have to testify that Bates said something to him about how he'd be better off if she were "the late Mrs. Bates." (He muttered something along those lines while he was with Lord G.) I'm not sure who killed her, but there are several possibilities. I wouldn't, however, put it past Vera to have killed herself in a final spiteful action. Wretched woman!

I DON'T like the little looks and hints between Jane the maid and Lord Grantham. Not sure what's going on there. At first I thought it may be "an Ethel situation" -- that she's not really a war widow, and she felt caught in a lie. Lord G. clearly remembers something about her son (or was he just referring to what was said when he first met her? And she was impressed that he would pay any attention at all to her, a mere servant?) He and Cora seemed genuinely happy in the first season, and I'd hate to see that changed just for the sake of soap drama.

I do wish that Bates and Anna had been able to resolve things at the beginning of this season and move on. There's plenty of other drama, and I think it might be more interesting to see the two of them unfold/develop as married characters, and how that fits into the household.

I don't think the Patrick character is really Patrick, but poor Edith! She's grown up, and is so caring now but she's usually still treated badly by Mary and ignored or dismissed by everyone else. Poor middle child! (I sympathize with you, poor, dear Edith!) :)

Poor Mary, too! Her life is just a mess now. Carlisle is a snake. I boo and hiss in his general direction.

And Sybil. Well, her feelings for Branson have seemed, to me, confused. She likes him, but does she love him? Enough to throw over her entire way of life? Hmmm. I'm not sure. She is, perhaps, the only one of the three daughters, however, who has acted as a young woman of that time period and social status might have acted, in terms of being more restrained and prudent in her actions with the opposite sex, even a man she's attracted to.

I had to laugh when Matthew was sitting outside talking with Mary and his left knee bounced up and down a little as he spoke to her. Just a tiny bit. I didn't think it was the character, I thought it was the actor, who's rather animated when he speaks, and just didn't realize he was moving it, and no one else noticed. But then, later, when he clearly felt a twinge of something, I wondered if maybe that tiny (reflexive?) action had been deliberate!

I think it was Charlotte (here in the comments) who said she was disappointed in the way they've changed Isobel's character. I agree. She started out as a smart and capable opponent for the Dowager Countess. Are the writers tired of the sparring, or feel it's going nowhere and that's why they're bringing Shirley Maclaine in?

I do think there's a different, far more soap operish feel to this season, but that's okay. I'm still enjoying it immensely. There were farfetched things in Season 1, too (Young, healthy Pamuk just dies?! Cora miscarries after a fall? Too-convenient plot devices ....)

[YHrobertWG]

Ставьте себе статусы для одноклассников здесь.

[Sue W]

Well, yes, it is a bit far-fetched, as another poster said. A bit soap opera-ish, you think? But...soap opera-ish or not, that's OK with me! I am watching it for entertainment and escape, and not looking for realism (I have plenty of realism right here at home lol.)

Since Daisy doesn't want to accept her widow's dole, maybe she will allow Edith to claim it? Just a thought...of course, that would have to get her into trouble somehow lol...

[Cristina]

I haven't made it through everyone's comments, so I apologize if I'm repeating things that have already been speculated. It's taken some time for me to process this last episode!

My family has decided that Sir Richard will somehow be responsible for Vera's murder. It would make sense in that he would want to protect the family he is marrying into and hold sway over this secret. It would also be the only way Mary would be able to get out of a marriage with him. Sorry, I don't see any other possible way. He is a vengeful type, not willing to let go unless it suits his own purposes, and if he lets go here, it will be detrimental to the Crawley family.

I hope it really is Patrick, but I think this could also be part of Sir Richard's schemes. Maybe he thinks Mary will be less interested in Matthew if he is no longer the heir?

Bates will be blamed (as usual) for Vera's death, and will probably think he deserves the blame. Seriously, he needs Anna. She has more faith in him than he has in himself.

That's all I can think of right now!

[Lindsey]

I am a DA fan through and through - but I'm starting to see some of the things the critics have been saying about season 2. It's a bit farfetched in parts. But then again, it's a TV drama :)

Still want to see Anna & Bates work out, still hate O'Brien, one day I like Mary, the next day I do not.... :)

[Jennifer N]

Here is a ghastly thought: Could Ethel and her baby be the first to die in the Spanish flu epidemic?

It would set the scene in a grim way... Mrs, Hughes finding them dead. Yikes- I hope not, come to think of it.

[Dawn]

Dear ladies, I am so grateful for all your comments! I love discussing Downton with you all!

I have to wonder about the preview for next week - the Spanish Flu affects Cora, Mr. Carson and Lavinia. Will this be the way we get rid of Lavinia? Or will her brush with death make Matthew love her all the more?

(And can I admit that the fact that he does truly love her pains me greatly? I want his love to be only for Mary!)

And what is this about Robert's lapse in judgement? Please don't let it be in regards to Jane. I will honestly lose all respect for him (and a bit for the show) if that happens.

Ahhh ... next Sunday can't come quickly enough!

Blessings to you all ... and thank you SO much for participating in this wonderful discussion!

~ Dawn

[Kristie]

Sorry about the book! Told you I thought it was a good one! =)

[Kristie]

Well, I thought it was a great show.
I loved the development between Mary and Sir Richard. Just when you think maybe they will be okay and are coming to grips with the frustration of that, he turns into a monster. Now I am on the edge of my seat waiting to see what happens.
The storylines and the timelines are too too confusing. How long has Lavinia been gone? And now she comes back not because of her love for Matthew, but because Sir Richard convinces her to come back? Um, really, really, not impressed with her. I'm not really going to miss her. Sorry. And if I were Matthew, I would have sent her packing. Mary wouldn't commit to him without money, and he threw her over. Lavinia wouldn't commit to him without the ability to walk, throw her over. And, that can't be real, true love. True love stays. No matter what. And it doesn't come back with lame excuses!!!
I really wish they would get more into what Cora is up too. I am fascinated by what "work" the Lady of the house would have! She could at least have a sentance, a few words just to let us know.
The "uselessness" of the Earl is a silly plot move, and I'm sure that he would have tons of things to do. And the thing with the maid blows my mind. Please let it not be! It makes no sense either, for Cora and Richard to be happy and engaging in marital relations one minute and then in danger of an affair the next.
Ethel I want to shake. She needs to stop wishing and hoping that the major/his family will come wisk her away to paradise because of the baby and start standing on her own two feet. Move. Get a wedding band, invent a soldier husband and get to work!!! And stop relying on Mrs. Huges for food! Where is her family? Did they say?
Bronson and Sybil make my head ache. I hope they don't run away together, and I can't imagine that that will end well.
Edith just needs therapy! She falls in love with anyone she meets! She doesn't even know this patient and she's planning her life with him. Ugh! And, I think he's a phony.
I do not understand getting Mrs. Crawley out again. I know that they want the house back, but it is their house, not her's. I am surprised that they lacked the backbone to tell her no, fund another building (like the place next door) as a hospital and leave her to be with her son in peace. And I am annoyed with Mrs. Crawley's reaction. She needs to be with her son, not all over for a "cause".
Bates and Anna are your classic tragic crossed lovers story, and it's wonderful. I hope it works out for them, I love happy endings. It's gonna be a bumpy ride.
I'm so sad to hear that we only have two more episodes!!! =( It's so much fun to "watch" with all you ladies!

[Nancy]

I totally think P. Gordon is an imposter! I also agree with the first commentor about his facial cover up. Seems overdone. And I didn't realize that you could lose your accent after amnesia.

I definitely think Obrien is involved with the death of Vera! I heard her mention something about arsenic in the same preview scene where Cora is ill.....Do you think that perhaps somehow Cora could have been sickened by the arsenic in some way. I thought I heard Obrien say something about a "terrible mistake".

Maggie Smith is my new hero! I think she it AWESOME in this show! She makes me laugh at least once every week!

[Helene]

Two hour episodes?? Hooray! Love all these comments! Reading them really heightens my experience of the show, thanks Dawn!

[Jen]

I think P Gordon is an impostor but I also thought he was a terrible actor! And I really struggle with the bad makeup! Who would wear a strange piece of gauze across his face like that? He seemed to be pretty well healed so the whole gauze thing seemed like part of the charade to me.

I am very disappointed in the distance growing between Lord Crawley and Cora. It seems so sudden and without cause, like they needed some tension between them and just threw this in. I can't quite figure out what the cause might have been?

Edith drives me crazy! She is a "flippity jibbity, a will of a wisp, a girl"! She can't make up her mind and seems to flit from one man to the next. I think if she were my sister, she would annoy me too! HAHA

Can't wait for next week. Does anyone know when season 3 begins? Do we have to wait an entire year??? Please say no!!

[Rain]

I am enjoying these DA discussions. I don't have much to add but I believe Sir Richard is paying Lavinia to dote on Matthew again at least until his (Sir R's) marriage to Mary is official. And once Matthew finds out that will be the end of Lavinia. At least I hope so!

[Jennifer N]

Woohoo! Twp hours next week.
But I'll bet money that the Spanish flu carries off Lavinia.

[bobbi @ revolution of love]

I posted my comments here and added a link to this discussion. http://revolutionoflove.stblogs.org/archives/2012/02/tv-talk---downt.html

To answer the Sarah’s question, we only have two episodes left! However, Episode 6 will be 2 hours long. The synopsis reads: "Downton Abbey" continues with the Spanish flu sweeping through the household and infecting Cora, Lavinia and Mr. Carson, among others. Mary, Sybil and Robert, meanwhile, each face a moment of truth."

Spanish flu?! Who will live? Who will die and open doors for other characters?

The final Episode 7 will be the UK Christmas Special and it too will be two hours.

[Jennifer N]

Oh, Penny-

The show moves so fast! I am always missing things. Last night I was not quick enough to catch who the sick woman was in the previews. I wondered all night and only figured it out today by reading here and then rewatching the preview trailer. I am so glad to know that I am not the only one who feels befuddled at times.

Sometimes I think I miss things because of the accent, sometimes I think that the show just moves so fast... sometimes I think I am just getting old, LOl.

Oh, and then there is always some interruption while I am watching it. Last week my dh wanted to talk to me about my Pay Pal account right during the show (he wanted to verify a charge since the cost had been split into two payments... why does Pay Pal do that?).
Anyway... argh. So I missed a chunk, and when I tried to rewatch that bit the next day my daughter came into the room playing music, so again I couldn't hear a thing. I felt doomed.... *sigh*

[sarahlcc]

I just found Downton Abbey a few weeks ago, and binged catching up with an all night season 1 party.

I think Sir Richard had that awful woman killed, but I didn't see the first 10 minutes of the show. I'm going to have to watch it again online. If he did, that would make a convenient way for him to be disposed of, as well as get Bates off the hook. Really, I wouldn't put it past him (Richard), that guy is pure evil. Mary is playing with fire, like she always does.

I *do* think Matthew is regaining feeling in his legs, but only because he was told that Mary still has feelings for him!

I don't know about P. Gordon ~ if he had stuck around, I would have thought he may have been the real deal, but popping off like that with a note.....hmmmm, not so sure!

[Penny]

Clearly I missed the math scholarship scene. Oops. Also, I've missed too much to talk intelligently about DA, my ideas seem to be waaaay off lol.

I do wonder though, if maybe Thomas followed Bates to London and killed Vera. Just a thought.

Anyway, I'm swearing off DA until the final final. It's just to mind consuming!

[Sarah]

I think there was perhaps one (subtle) scene from last night's episode in which Cora seemed tired, or that she wasn't feeling well ... She didn't complain or anything. It was just in how she was acting ... Not sure about this, but it did cross my mind ... Am not super happy about how the Lord and Lady seem to be leading separate lives these days ... They seemed to be so happy. I do not even want to think about an affair, especially after she gets so sick. Ugh! NO!

[Jennifer N]

I have to say that I thought Maggie Smith absolutely stole the show last night. Her scene with Isobel- fishing for some worthy work that might interest her and keep her away from DA- was hilarious. I was surprised, though, that there was no scene with Isobel and Matthew, and that she would be so anxious to go away from her paralyzed son.

It does look like Matthew is going to regain some of his lower mobility.... I do hope so! I think he must or we wouldn't have seen Violet telling him about Mary in the previews. Sir Richard has gone from just annoying to downright ugly. I hate how he threatened Mary. Maybe long term Carson will be there to rescue her from abuse and Matthew will marry her. But in the Scene from Episode 6 you get the feeling Richard wouldn't even let her cut her hair if she wanted to.... boo, hiss for him. Ick.

It does look like Bates is gong to be in trouble. And I find it funny that all through the war Thomas still ate meals with the servants. Why? Wouldn't he have been eating with the rest of the medical staff?

I know there seems to be trouble brewing with the new maid, Jane... but I did love how her
eyes lit up talking about her son and how she said she wasn't too proud to accept Lord Grantham's help in getting him a math scholarship. I would think if Robert was the father of that boy he would recognize Jane, and that does not seem to be the case. But maybe Patrick or the other heir had an affair with her and so the boy is related after all.

Was Patrick for real? Don't know. Have we seen the last of him????

I would say that influenza is a good guess as far as Cora's illness. Next week should be another good one!

[Jill]

I just love reading all these theories! Usually I am the read ahead and find out everything, but so far I have avoided temptation.

Is there any possibility that Jane's 12 year old son is the Lord's heir? On the wrong side of the blanket? Although I don't see how that would solve their problems...I feel sure the entail would require a legal heir?

[www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=1507113894]

I must of missed something last night. I was disappointed in the episode. It was predictable for me. I saw Mrs. Bates murder and Patrick coming back from the dead.

Edith is so kind and keeps getting her heart stepped on. Reality you would check and double check and triple check this guy's story before saying he is the lost heir. Mary was right and she was just lovely defending Matthew. When it came to Mary being threatened by Sir Richard...really she said OK. Out of character for her.

Is O'Brien a bad person or a good person. She leaves me wondering all the time. Why is there a maid on the outskirts with a baby. Just does not seem to fit. She is an outcast and would of been in those days. I enjoy this show very much just not last night.

[Sarah]

Hmmm ... Not sure what to think about this last episode. It was all so dramatic! Usually, I love every detail, but in this episode, I did not ... I am not sure about "Patrick." I also think it would be hard to lose an accent in just 6 years, but could that have been part of the amnesia? But with this storyline, I felt more for Edith than I did for him. That poor girl! She is so caring, and everyone just brushes past her ... Mary was starting to grow on me, but I didn't like how she spoke to Edith in the family meeting. [And how no one said anything in her defense!] Mary's old (mean!) ways seemed to shine through a bit. And I do think a Lord would be more busy, but I don't think there will be an affair. I am wondering about a past, though, with the maid. But on the other hand, Lord Grantham just seems too *good* and loyal to his family ... I do suspect the new maid of something though ... And what about Carson?! I don't see how Mary could even ask him to leave his position. He is so essential to Downton! I didn't like that at all ... Maybe it won't ever come about, if Mary and Richard don't marry. (He was very cruel to her, threatening her like that.) Let's hope for good, ol' Carson =) BTW, how many episodes are left? It seems like a lot is hanging out there to be wrapped up anytime soon ... Am so happy about a third season!

[Lisa Taylor]

Quite the busy episode wasn't it! I'm still wondering what "work" it is that Cora is so occupied with. It seems simply a plot device of making Lord Grantham look like a lost little boy. I would think a Lord would have *something to do! I wonder if he and the new maid have had some sort of past together - her son, could the boy possibly be Lord Grantham's as well?? Hmmmm...

I think Matthew will regain feeling in his legs. I just can't like Lavinia no matter how much I try. He and Mary are obviously meant for one another.

I cannot stand Sir Charles and cannot see Mary staying with him - especially after their last little encounter. She's much too high spirited for him. After Vera, his is the character I like least, and now that Vera is gone perhaps an accident may befall him as well Would the scandalous newspaper story die with him I wonder??

I think "Patrick" is an impostor; though one does have to feel horribly sorry for the character. That could go either way of course, and change the storyline entirely. His temper did make me wonder though - and the "motion over his lips" habit makes me more suspicious of him than ever!

Of course Bates will be accused of killing Vile Vera and of course I don't think he did! (I think....) Everyone wants he and Anna to be happy!

And the previews: I certainly hope O'Brien doesn't tell Cora the truth of the miscarriage. Though I don't like O'Brien - it would ruin her life and make it harder on Cora I think.

Isn't Maggie Smith wonderful? She really makes the entire series for me. I can't wait for Shirley MacLaine next season. (Hmmm...many have speculated she was crossing the pond for a wedding - let's do hope it isn't for Cora's funeral!!!

I can't wait for next week :-)

(And I really don't think Cora will die. But it would be a shocker wouldn't it?)

[Penny]

Ok. So I watched, just to play with all of you :) And I still feel like DA is too much drama, not enough tea. That said, I think Patrick is real. Matthew will be able to provide an heir, get married to Lavinia, and then they will find Patrick is the real deal. Patrick will marry Edith and ensure DA. Then Lavinia goes away somehow (dies? divorce?) and Matthew will marry Mary, who will not give a hoot about DA now that she has Matthew. Sir Richard is making too many enemies. I feel sure he is doomed somehow. Perhaps Mary will dig up some of *his* skeletons and escape the marriage altogether. Which would be good. He's very mean. Besides which, they can't get married. The butler must stay!

Hm. Maybe Sir Richard and the evil maid (who I feel sure is not a widow and has no child)? That would solve *that* problem...

And can I just say - I love Daisy. I hope good things happen for her.

[Roselady]

My guess is that maybe Sir Richard dug up "Patrick." He's crafty, and he's got reporters to do the research...

[Dawn]

Well, there were so many interesting developments last night!

I am very torn about the stranger. I could see him not being Patrick Crawley, but his friend Peter, who - for whatever reasons - greed/loneliness/love for a woman Patrick may have talked about (Edith) - decided to pretend to be the heir. But I don't know ... it could go either way! He certainly had a temper. And yes, the motion over his lips that Lord Grantham noticed ... that was something. I think the family should have asked him more questions to see if there was something he could answer that only the real Patrick Crawley would know.

Poor Edith - I did feel badly for her. :(

Lord Grantham and the new maid Jane making eyes at each other - NOT LIKING THAT! I can just see them setting this up. But there's something about Jane I don't trust. Not sure if it's her backstory (is she really a widow?) or if it's the looks she's had on her face around Lord G. I hate to think where this might go ...

(And don't even get me started on the previews for next week showing Cora writhing in agony, sick in bed. This is 1918, right? The year of the Spanish flu?)

Matthew and Lavinia - I don't want it! I feel bad because she does love him, obviously, but he's just meant to be with Mary. Him getting feelings back in his legs might push him to accept Lavinia again ... BUT. In the previews we see the Dowager Countess telling him that Mary is still in love with him! And he looks shocked! So what will he do with that knowledge???

{How much do we love Maggie Smith? She's the heart and soul of this show!}

Bates will get framed for Vera's murder I'm sure of it. He was last with her, everyone *knows* he went to see her, and he had that scratch on his face. But I don't think he did it. I feel O'Brien will be involved in this somehow - even just spreading stories and leading people's thoughts. She's too interested in all this. And she's a snoop and a sneak.

OK, that's all I can think of right now ... I know there's more, but I will have to jump back in when I can.

Thanks, all, for joining in the discussion! :D

[Charlotte]

I too think P. Gordon is an impostor. He was a little too melodramatic and I don't think 6 years is long enough to erase a British accent and replace it with a Canadian one. Heck, the sweet widow who lives across the street has lived here in Texas for 20 some odd years and she still has a very recognizable Massachusetts accent. And Bates is so going to be suspected of Vera's death. I do think they meant to indicate that Matthew might be healing and I think that means good things for Mary. I don't think she will go through with the wedding to Carlisle but I'm not sure if Matthew will marry her or Lavinia. Is anybody else tired of O'Brien and Thomas? I mean, I know we aren't supposed to like them and they are supposed to provide conflict, but I'm really just tired of them. They are kind of just annoying now. There is plenty of conflict without them. And Mrs. Crawley! Her character started out as such a witty, somewhat wise woman (not perfect, but she still had her moments) and now they've almost turned her into the fool. I don't like that and I don't believe for a minute that the person she started out as would be so blinded by flattery as not to see what was going on. And I find it really hard to believe that Sybil's feeling for Branson have been kindled so strongly when we've hardly seen them. It was kind of a little hard to believe that she would now be so in love with him as to announce it to her family so I'm thinking they will have discovered them in some way and she will be forced to choose between him and her family. She will probably choose him although it seems like she would have more respect for her family after they have grown so much and given of themselves so much more than before the war.

[Caroline Haydu]

I think the mystery man is Peter Gordon, and that he began falling in love with Edith and found it "too difficult" to continue his con. I just can't accept that Matthew and Mary won't get married and live at Downton Abbey! It has to be happily ever after! Also, what was that little scene between Lord Grantham and Mr. Gordon, where Mr. Gordon made what looked like the sign of the cross over his mouth? What was the significance of that gesture and why did they draw attention to it? There has to be more to that than this episode revealed...just a hint of foreshadowing? So, I do think we will see more of this particular story line in future episodes.
Loved the Dowager Countess once again taking charge and so deftly persuading Mrs.Crawley that she had better things to do elsewhere. I think Mr. Bates didn't kill Vera, but that he'll be accused of doing so. Maybe Richard had her done in? So she wouldn't have any hold over him or Mary?
Still wondering what Lord Grantham is doing with all his time...this week it seemed that they almost highlighted his purposeless when Cora left the house and he was standing on the stairs just sort of at a loss.
Can't wait for next week's episode1

[Sue W]

P. Gordon just has to be an imposter! I'm not believing him for a minute!

Lots of cliffhangers in this episode!! Will Lady Mary really marry Sir Richard? Who killed Mrs. Bates? Was Matthew regaining feeling in his legs, when Bates was pushing his chair? Does this mean he will eventually walk again, and be able to produce an heir?

And now we have to wait a whole week...

[Arlene Grimm]

Glad to know who the mystery man is!! I wondered if it might be Patrick but was surprised that he did survive the Titanic! In real life I tend to be a cynic but I am hoping that he is Patrick and that he and Edith will find happiness together. She gets my vote for the Most Changed character in this mini series. Looking forward to next week as usual!